Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

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nathansixchime
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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by nathansixchime » Mon Jul 28, 2014 10:45 am

Bob Durnell wrote:Would/could the Cass Street Depot become part of the FWRHS complex, or is that likely to remain private property?


If you look at the rendering at the link, the consultants envision the station becoming part of the "historic railroad experience" with the Outfitters and Bike Depot being relocated elsewhere on the riverfront. In our conversations with the owners, who have been advocates of the plan and friends of mine, there are several possibilities being kicked around that could see them stay put or move across the Harrison, with the station remaining at Cass Street. At its simplest, we could construct some sort of boarding platform with a similar architectural style across the track if they ultimately choose to stay. It's in my personal interest to keep them as neighbors, even if they are outgrowing the building, to retain/enhance the mixed use/foot traffic on/near the site. The Hall family has created something pretty unique there that extends beyond the building itself onto the banks and nearby trail.
Would ANY of the existing bottling company buildings be of any use to the FWRHS? There I am with those pesky questions again... Back to the ironic depatment, IF after you and 765 did the "Coca Cola ad project", the FWRHS end up on the former home of the Pepsi bottler. :lol:
Don't think we'd want to use anything that's there presently. This would be ground-up.
Kelly Lynch
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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by cjberndt » Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:01 pm

Kelly:

I'm referring to official R/W abandonment: STB and state filings, notice to shippers, etc. What is aesthetic abandonment?

What R/W does the railroad still own west of St. Mary's Ave.? I'm working on projects in the area north of the PRR mainline and we haven't found deeds for the FtW&J mainline. Tax records and ICC maps aren't official in this context, but maybe they reference the deed records or other relevant documents.

Craig

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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by nathansixchime » Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:01 pm

Everything I've seen the city put out shows railroad ownership existing save for between Sherman/St. Marys, all the way up to and through North River.

*Edited to add that fortunately the only encroachments exist at Sherman/St.Marys where the chain link fence exists.

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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by dbrackin7 » Mon Aug 11, 2014 5:01 pm

Wasn't their a flat car or gondola outside the Fort Wayne outfitters at one time? If so what happened to it?
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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by nathansixchime » Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:12 pm

Originally a NKP sleeper, burned, now the frame and trucks are the platform for two storage containers for the Bike Depot.
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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by cjberndt » Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:22 pm

Kelly:

Calhoun Investments, LLC (Rifkins, et al), owns all of the former railroad property from the corner of 3rd and Calhoun north to the north side of the former OmniSource site. NS owns from there to State Blvd., and the City’s Redevelopment Dept. owns State to Fernhill. I don’t think anything north of Fernhill is still railroad property, but maybe a remnant or two. I had to determine all of the ownerships just listed for a couple of projects and can provide scans of my working papers and deeds.

South of 3rd and Calhoun, NS apparently owns all of the right-of-way to the NKP, except, as you said, that part between Sherman and St. Mary’s Ave., which is evenly split between the adjoining property owners on each side. I only have the deed records for the Sherman-St. Mary’s section. I haven’t been able to find deeds or other records transferring the right-of-way in this area to the FWJ&S or any other railroad except the GR&I near Swinney Park. I need to get in the courthouse archives and research the court cases.

So, for the riverfront study’s recommendation of a roundhouse at the Cass St. depot, the Sherman-St. Mary’s Ave. right-of-way will need to be reacquired along with the Pepsi warehouse land. Construction at the former OmniSource site will also require acquisition of the land north of 3rd and Calhoun from Calhoun Investments.

Craig Berndt

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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by nathansixchime » Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:57 pm

Thanks, Craig. The city has already engaged Pepsi about the property and I'm meeting with NS tomorrow afternoon regarding their remaining properties.
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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by Bob Durnell » Fri Aug 15, 2014 10:55 am

If FWRHS were to get the Pepsi property, eating dinner on the patio at the Mexican place on Wells would get a LOT more interesting! :D
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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by Hotbox » Fri Aug 29, 2014 3:49 pm

I wonder how the residents of the "emergency dorm" at the Rescue Mission are going to enjoy all the new pan handling opportunities?

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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by nathansixchime » Mon Sep 01, 2014 9:23 pm

Depends on how development effects the mission...there are two very different approaches being considered.
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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by nathansixchime » Thu Oct 02, 2014 10:59 pm

cjberndt wrote: South of 3rd and Calhoun, NS apparently owns all of the right-of-way to the NKP, except, as you said, that part between Sherman and St. Mary’s Ave., which is evenly split between the adjoining property owners on each side. I only have the deed records for the Sherman-St. Mary’s section. I haven’t been able to find deeds or other records transferring the right-of-way in this area to the FWJ&S or any other railroad except the GR&I near Swinney Park. I need to get in the courthouse archives and research the court cases.
Craig Berndt
Craig, I've been told that the line between Sherman and St. Marys has actually been evenly leased to the adjacent owners, which is fitting with railroad practice more so than outright sale and perhaps explains the lack of records. This is at least what some in Community Development have uncovered and relayed my way.
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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by Notch 8 » Fri Oct 03, 2014 5:32 am

nathansixchime wrote:
cjberndt wrote: South of 3rd and Calhoun, NS apparently owns all of the right-of-way to the NKP, except, as you said, that part between Sherman and St. Mary’s Ave., which is evenly split between the adjoining property owners on each side. I only have the deed records for the Sherman-St. Mary’s section. I haven’t been able to find deeds or other records transferring the right-of-way in this area to the FWJ&S or any other railroad except the GR&I near Swinney Park. I need to get in the courthouse archives and research the court cases.
Craig Berndt
Craig, I've been told that the line between Sherman and St. Marys has actually been evenly leased to the adjacent owners, which is fitting with railroad practice more so than outright sale and perhaps explains the lack of records. This is at least what some in Community Development have uncovered and relayed my way.
I was told by the owner of Applied Metals that He owns half of the ROW and Schenkels purchased the other half, Gary need the ROW as an entrance off Wells to enter the back side of His Facility

On a side note I got the mile post from the ROW at St Mary's and it's MP 2, 2 miles from what was my question ?

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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by Greg46m » Thu Oct 09, 2014 10:30 pm

Notch 8 wrote:
I was told by the owner of Applied Metals that He owns half of the ROW and Schenkels purchased the other half, Gary need the ROW as an entrance off Wells to enter the back side of His Facility

On a side note I got the mile post from the ROW at St Mary's and it's MP 2, 2 miles from what was my question ?
Did the LS&MS line technically begin at Junction? I ask because in a 1936 NYC Fort Wayne Branch TT, it references the southern portion of the line being the crossing with the PRR. Junction would be close to 2 miles from St Mary's I would guestimate.
http://www.michiganrailroads.com/RRHX/T ... Branch.htm

I see on there it mentions the crossings of the NKP, B&O and PRR. I'm guessing the B&O reference would be where it crossed the GR&I at Park, so was that line owned by the B&O at that time? I've never heard of that but it makes me curious.
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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by nathansixchime » Sat Oct 11, 2014 4:53 pm

Greg,

I thought that I'd read that MP 0 for the FW&J was at the Runnion block, but perhaps not.

As for Applied Metals, Gary has been aware of this plan for a while. He has said he's willing to part with those warehouses between the ROW and the river. That area is more than likely to become part of the proposed promenade area. We'd probably want to give his driveway/parking lot some asphalt or cement surface and work to make sure the ROW doesn't interfere. It more than likely won't reach past the pump station, but the plan will likely include a few hundred feed of track to be able to park/board longer trains. It would be a sight better than the shoddy dilapidated track that was there before, maybe even with the rails set inside the cement.

KL
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Re: Feasability study planned for river and rail attraction

Post by nathansixchime » Sat Oct 11, 2014 4:58 pm

For anyone interested, there are two more meetings planned this month regarding the riverfront project: http://riverfrontfw.org/news/upcoming-events
Kelly Lynch
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Fort Wayne Railroad Historical Society
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